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Episode 70: The Ace and Cakes

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Shell Game:
In light of the fact that even in real-life queer spaces the mentality of "asexuality is not necessarily a queer identity that needs to be hugely prioritized in the grand scheme of things, and don't even get me started on shit like demisexuality and aromanticism" is quickly becoming solely associated with shitty TERFs who think that gold-star lesbians are the only people who actually deserve the queer community, I am so glad I can go back and listen to this episode to stay sane. Thanks, The F Plus.
TheCrawlingChaos, October 24, 2019, 06:23:07 pm
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That reminds me: I was recently reading this old article on Medium, in which the author argues that trans individuals should be equally as accepting of otherkin identities and not accuse them of "appropriating" trans terminology and identity, which I feel kind of bumps up against the same kind of black and white mindset you're talking about.

It feels a bit akin to the Geek Social Fallacies, only applied within groups of actual, marginalized individuals.
KingKalamari, October 25, 2019, 11:26:57 am
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YEAH THAT ATTITUDE IS STILL OUT THERE AND IT FUCKING SUCKS.

Hi. :)

TheCrawlingChaos:
In light of the fact that even in real-life queer spaces the mentality of "asexuality is not necessarily a queer identity that needs to be hugely prioritized in the grand scheme of things, and don't even get me started on shit like demisexuality and aromanticism" is quickly becoming solely associated with shitty TERFs who think that gold-star lesbians are the only people who actually deserve the queer community, I am so glad I can go back and listen to this episode to stay sane. Thanks, The F Plus.
TheCrawlingChaos, October 24, 2019, 06:23:07 pm
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That reminds me: I was recently reading this old article on Medium, in which the author argues that trans individuals should be equally as accepting of otherkin identities and not accuse them of "appropriating" trans terminology and identity, which I feel kind of bumps up against the same kind of black and white mindset you're talking about.

It feels a bit akin to the Geek Social Fallacies, only applied within groups of actual, marginalized individuals.
KingKalamari, October 25, 2019, 11:26:57 am
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I was actually tossing around the GSF comparison a couple days back, so thank you for putting that into words. It's especially infuriating to me when it gets used to guilt bi and trans people into "the mean gays and lesbians don't want any of us in the community, so we all need to stick together!" Sadly, it seems to be working, with otherwise sane people in those groups (and gay dudes/lesbians who don't want to be seen as stodgy bigots) being like "why do you hate asexuals? We're so much stronger together!" Like... leaving aside anecdata about condoms being hidden in queer resource centers to keep from offending asexuals (which I am a big enough person to admit is solely anecdata from where I'm standing) what exactly makes a community stronger just by expanding the parameters of who's defined as part of it? Surely the asexuals (and kinksters and poly people and...) who would already be in favor of queer issues would still be supportive, and those who are basically using it as a smokescreen to be huge homophobes wouldn't, but then I guess they wouldn't get to feel better than those gross cishet ~allies~ who are probably just in it for the buttpats from people with actual problems.

Shell Game:
I've said this before elsewhere but i sincerely believe our downfall was creating a movement centered on self-identifying language. There's ofc merit to the freedom to express one's experience succinctly and be taken seriously, however we put so much power solely in theory over lived experiences and conditions it was only a matter of time before the apparatus was co-opted by people who think all experiences are theirs to try on. Like when white new agers determine it's their religious right to traipse into native sacred places: despite them not also having a historical connection to the land, the technicalities of vague legal and social restrictions make for equivocation to be made between the groups because, technically, they both hold spiritual beliefs that must be honored. We'll just set aside the lived experience of having land, life and culture devalued and robbed at every turn and operate on the false notion of equality being measured from a baseline for all peoples. Honestly this is exactly how appropriation works, and it works REALLY WELL.

Tl;dr we've once against ignored the base to prioritize the superstructure.

xX_sp00ks_Xx:
I've said this before elsewhere but i sincerely believe our downfall was creating a movement centered on self-identifying language.Shell Game, October 27, 2019, 08:26:48 am
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Martin Luther emphatically not nailing the 95 genders on the wall.

TheCrawlingChaos:
I've said this before elsewhere but i sincerely believe our downfall was creating a movement centered on self-identifying language. There's ofc merit to the freedom to express one's experience succinctly and be taken seriously, however we put so much power solely in theory over lived experiences and conditions it was only a matter of time before the apparatus was co-opted by people who think all experiences are theirs to try on. Like when white new agers determine it's their religious right to traipse into native sacred places: despite them not also having a historical connection to the land, the technicalities of vague legal and social restrictions make for equivocation to be made between the groups because, technically, they both hold spiritual beliefs that must be honored. We'll just set aside the lived experience of having land, life and culture devalued and robbed at every turn and operate on the false notion of equality being measured from a baseline for all peoples. Honestly this is exactly how appropriation works, and it works REALLY WELL.

Tl;dr we've once against ignored the base to prioritize the superstructure.
Shell Game, October 27, 2019, 08:26:48 am
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And yet the vast majority of asexual=queer types would fall over themselves to be angry at white New Agers tramping all over native spaces while vociferously denying there's any resemblance between the things you mention. The ironing is delicious.

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